Unwanted increase in speed when cueing in a track

This only happens if you don’t assign the sync according to a ritual from the start when you turn on the machine. But anyways, the sync feature is a little sloppy.

My settings;

instant start on

sync set to beat.

quantize on.

I noticed once that when the speed up issue happened that the pitch fader was +/-8 on one layer and +/-100 on the other layer (with sync and quantize on). I don’t know how it was set to 100, I looked at the preference on the deck and both were set to +/-8. I could only change it back by holding shift and the pitch bend buttons

Layer A is audible. I loaded layer B and pressed play. You hear it slow down and speed up while master is blinking for no reason.

The last firmware destroyed more than it fixed. It is unusable, unless you enjoy crackling noises.

Well… it’s been here for a while now.

So, playing a few times and this happens (see video). Seems to me to be an issue with the firmware routines handling the first hot cue, as using the second hot cue and moving the platter had no effect.

Hey Guys,

Apologies for the late reply!!

I’m reading through this and trying to understand the issue(s) but the thread topic is frequently changing. This makes it a little difficult to pull the relevant data needed for our developers to investigate reports.

I’m not dismissing any of these reports, just looking for your help to keep things on topic so we can understand the issues and pass them on to the appropriate team to identify and fix them as quickly as possible.

It seems that in most cases, the unwanted speed increase occurs while SYNC is active. Is this true for anyone who has experienced this?

Has anyone experienced this behavior with multiple players (using layer A only) or does it only occur when mixing between layers on the same player?

If anyone has a 100% repro for this, please post the explicit steps to reproduce below.

Thanks everyone for your help! We’ll get to the bottom of this!

Thank you for the video! I’ve sent to our Dev team for investigation. Could you provide the essential reproduction steps to induce the state that you’re experiencing?

Thank you for the video it is very useful! Does this always happen 100% of the time? Are you able to provide steps to reproduce the issue?

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Thanks for the video! Are you mixing in with layers A and B on both players? Does the issue occur when you mix without using layers?

Here’s another video. Tune playing on the other layer exhibits pitch slowing and acceleration when using the platter to move over the first hot cue on the other layer. Moving to the second hot cue alleviates the problem.

I expect that the hot cue issue I originally experienced is caused by the same routine. (Sorry, ex-programmer, can’t help analysing the issue, it’s in the blood!)

Planning on calling Denon DJ UK to discuss this today. Will post a follow up.

Completely agree with MCharade. This unit cost me over £1k. The basics should work correctly straight out of the box so you’re not made to look like a newb when you’re spinning a few. Denon should be all over this post and let us know what being done. This is such a fundamental thing to have right, I’d be looking for Pioneer employees in my software team!

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There are at least two issues.

One definitely seems to have to do with layers, sync, and cues and is pretty subtle. According to the videos, it appears to affect both the non-M and the M.

The other speed issue is where the M’s motor changes speed suddenly and doesn’t reset until you put the pitch fader at zero. The screen doesn’t change and the record speed detection still functions properly. This is not subtle when it happens and has nothing to do with sync.

That’s no joke. I had the same thought with all of Gemini’s problems on the MDJ.

Hi @JWiLL, thanks for replying!

Yes, i can reproduce the error on my 5000 non-M. Few observations:

  • This happens when playing AIFF files
  • This happens when i play both layers on the same player (not cross device)
  • This happens when the one layer is playing + the master and a new track is loaded and started in the other layer.
  • This only happens when sync is on, but regardless of the type of sync (tempo, beat).

Personal thought:

The player is setting the tempo of the loaded track to the master clock when you press play. So not on load (like Traktor does). This causes an (unnecessary) peak in CPU load, because the player has to do several things at the same time (play, tempo sync, beatmatch, keylock). High quality audio files (AIFF) demand a lot of the system already. So maybe syncing the tempo clock on load will provide you with and option to better distribute that load. It also means the player will not have to beatsync (cause it already aligns the track on 1 on load), which is 1 task less to compute.

This does not completely fix the strange behavior of course. It is strange the master layer is accepting tempo changes from other sources.

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All great info - much appreciated! A couple of follow up questions:

Are you able to reproduce the issue with mp3 or Wav files?

Do you have solid repro steps or does it happen randomly?

There appear to be solid reproduction steps for the first, subtle issue related to cues, layer, and sync that affects both players.

My initial hunch on the not-subtle M motor speed thing is that it may be related to heat but prior to the fans turning on, but that’s obviously hard to test. I was sort of cooking my Mackie mixer with it right up against the Ms to get it to happen. It could also be related to layers, since from my own videos it happens after I have previously used the other layer, even if it’s not playing on the background layer. So maybe a soft takeover source of it is another possibility.

Well, the video was made spontaneously and about 1 minute after Reticuli asked for a video. And this was the second try, cause i filmed it the wrong way the first time (also happened though). So quite a solid repro, i think.

I could try to redo it with mp3’s and WAV’s. I have those. But i currently am not able to and very busy, so lets see if you can reproduce it with AIFF’s at the office first. :slight_smile:

Also: i am on firmware 1.2.0. Firmware 1.2.2. is bugged for AIFF playback, as you can read (and is reproduced very solidly) in this thread: 1.2.2: electrical interference noise when loading new tracks

Not in the mood to upgrade to 1.2.2. again to test if that firmware still has the issue. It probably has, because all previous versions have it. Plus i’ll have to downgrade again, and am busy enough as it is.


What are your pitch fader range settings? When that happened to you did you notice a change in the pitch range on any of your layers?

Default settings on pitch range. Not touching the pitch range fader when playing with sync.

So I’ve been in touch with InMusicBrands who are Denon DJ’s parent company. Here is part of their response…

"The issue is starting to look like there is a hardware fault with the unit and in that instances it may be best for you to return the unit back to the place of purchase to organise a warranty return.

I will be showing the videos and link you have sent over so far to my collegues for further investigating and we hope to get the bottom of this issue as soon as possible.

Thank you so much for your detailed reponse and continued support in our products. "

I would take that with a grain of salt. Most of the issues I see look like they can be fixed by filtering or by the mapping away of it in the software.

Let’s just say that if the platter is supposed to only control the layer that you are on then how come it seems like it’s dictating to both? The solution would be is to ensure that the other layer/deck ignores the platter, right? But we’re using sync so now the software has to take into account both layers/decks, it can no longer ignore some things. And there is where the rabbit hole lays.

Hardware issues are noticeable on the face, when you see them you will know.

Software issues are dictation problems.

Too bad I can’t connect this to my computer as controller yet. I could see a lot of things, probably do a lot of things too.