Motorised jogwheels

[Dajman73]

Firstly, thank you for reading this and I appreciate any advice. Also, apologies if this is in the wrong section. I have searched for answers but cannot find ones for my situation!

Raver/clubber from the 90s here . Always more interested in dance floor side of the decks and never djing. Brought my son a Numark controller that he tried to get to grips with a few years ago, but never really clicked for him and probably he started too young (although it was what he said he wanted on his Christmas list!).

Anyway, now he is 14 and much more into it. After a lot of research and plenty of joint saving, we bit the bullet and purchased a Prime 4+. Got a right good 2nd hand deal and well impressed with that kit. Also purchased Crossfader Prime 4 beginner and intermediate courses.

That has been a revelation, as learning to DJ with a well structured course, designed for the hardware in front of him has been great and the progress, fun and engagement has been outstanding.

So much so that I have been doing it with him and now really have the bug! . It is great father and son bonding and the opportunity to get him into some of the music from my day, plus exploring the modern stuff together is brilliant.

So now to my question. I am already considering an upgrade again, to flagship products and love the Denon brand so will be sticking with that. I’m also eagerly awaiting news on the sc6000 replacements as if I did upgrade I’d want something that will then last years.

But, to “M” or not, that is the question??

I can’t say I have any history with DJing on vinyl myself, but 1210s are what mates had and vinyl is my era. I think the spinning deck looks cooler (yes that does matter!) and who knows, I may like to try some scratching when I get better.

I guess the thing is I don’t want to regret not getting the motorised platter version down the line. For a few quid more it seems sensible. But, will I like motorised platters if I didn’t learn to mix on vinyl?

I’m only ever going to be an “at home DJ”, but who knows what my son could do in years to come as well.

Any thoughts on the right purchase for us would be appreciated!

Many thanks all

Yours

Totally confused!

[STU-C]

I personally wouldn’t get motorised digital decks, it’s more things to go wrong and we have several threads on here with people having issues around lubrication and some other stuff. Outside of looking cool I don’t really get them, unless of course you’re into scratching but even then most of the scratch DJs are using actual decks still.

Honest opinion, if you’re going to spend cash why not buy a pair of turntables and connect them to the 4+? you can then run that in Serato mode with a laptop and use DVS if you want to mess around mixing on actual decks (might have to check this actually works though, not sure if the internal card supports DVS), and it allows you to also buy some vinyl and play that too.

[mufasa]

@Dajman73

But, to “M” or not, that is the question??

Get the Ms. The 6000Ms.

I have a set of 6000m from release date and they are the truth.

[Pasha]

The motor is one more thing to go wrong and is frequently listed as something which seems to muck up a mix by adding too much wow or flutter to the turntables speed … (wow and flutter being slight speeding up/slurring down of the playback speed) - not necessarily a firmware correctable thing, more just down to motors and spindle tightness and all that jazz.

Plus, you’ll lose the platter/jog wheel display on motorised units. (The display space is taken up by the motor )

[MrWilks]

I have static and motorised.

If you want the vinyl feel then the 6000Ms are the business. For scratching they are without doubt the best. If you’re just after just A to B mixing then the standard 6000s are perfect.

You find you’ll use the pitch bend buttons on the M models anyway as there’s no real satisfaction from the push/pull of the platter. You can turn off the motor and they work similar to the non-motorised (almost - there’s no touch platter for detecting a finger).

The lubrication of the platters is something that may or may not need doing after a few years as the grease can dry out causing the aforementioned wow & flutter. Even Technics suffer from this and is done when you service them. It’s easily done yourself though.

My advise would be the non-motorised version unless you want to learn scratching.

[Parysatis]

Hi

I have a pair of SC6000M players, they are much fun and so far I cannot report any issues. Yes, maybe they need to be serviced some time in the future, I don’t know, but that can become necessary for my Technics turntables as well. Nothing is made for eternity …

Maybe you can find a shop that has both models on display, try out both of them, touch them. In my case I felt intuitively connected to the motorized platters.

You definitely need no vinyl record mixing or turntable skills to have a good time on the motorized players and deliver a great mix, the motor can be deactivated too and the mixing experience is much more like on digital jog wheel players. I am not a scratching DJ, so I cannot really compare it to an actual turntable, it may be a matter of personal preference and skill … to me the motorized platters feel a bit more organic or natural, though I still consider my Technics turntables the best thing in the world.

[SlayForMoney]

I’m gonna play the devils advocate and say that even Prime 4 is overkill for both you and your boy.

There is a reason beginner level equipment exists and by the time you learn all of the Prime 4 features it will be obsolete.

[Wyley1]

I’d go with the motorized platters. I have the 5000m and I enjoy it. Tried to get another one but ended up getting the Rane One.

I don’t notice wow and flutter so far between my motorized jogs. However I accepted the fact that maintenance will have to eventually be performed on those jogs.

Looking at the new Rane device my advice to you is to wait for the new 6000m models to come out because it seems that they will receive the same type motorized jog that the new Rane has.

[PKtheDJ]

LOL herein lies the problem with asking a bunch of DJs whether or not to get this or that kit!

We all have different preferences, and the replies tend to be based on what they would do, rather than what might be best for you.

I’d say that if you’ve never used vinyl then you’re not going to miss the feel of rotating platters.

When I started DJing, vinyl on turntables was the only option - but I’m not bothered about emulating it. I’m quite happy using jogs or even just pressing/clicking buttons.

[Gaian]

All the users complaining about slow motorized platter issues related to grease issues that I have seen here so far have been SC5000M users. I have yet to see any Sc6000M users complaining about problems like this. I think the grease used on the 5000M was too thick or of lower quality and that InMusic/Denon must have corrected this by using a thinner or better quality grease.

Static jogs have their share of problems too, between the wear of the braking/hardness system tending to release plastic dust and the problems linked to capacitive technology often posing a problem in places where grounding is bad, something that never happens on M models because the technology used is different.

Each version has its advantages and disadvantages.

[Mixlive]

What’s Up @Dajman73,

I purchased a set of 5000m’s nearly three years ago and never regretted it. I also own a Prime 4 (bought 4 years ago). The P4 goes out on gigs more than the M’s (because of less set up), but I prefer the M’s.

I grew up playing on vinyl and the M’s feel really natural for me. Sounds like your looking for something for personal use than for gigs, so I recommend if you go the M route to look for a pair of 5000m’x. You might find a decent price on a set up 5000m’s instead of paying full price for the 6000M’s.

Good luck and have fun!

Here’s a mix that I did playing around with a genre of music that I don’t normally play (just having fun).

CUBATON DJ Mix /UN AMERICANO Toca Musica Cubana | DJs Make The Party

[Dajman73]

@STU-C

Honest opinion, if you’re going to spend cash why not buy a pair of turntables and connect them to the 4+? you can then run that in Serato mode with a laptop and use DVS if you want to mess around mixing on actual decks (might have to check this actually works though, not sure if the internal card supports DVS), and it allows you to also buy some vinyl and play that too.

Thanks Stu. Interesting suggestion, but not sure I want to start collecting vinyl!!

@Parysatis

You definitely need no vinyl record mixing or turntable skills to have a good time on the motorized players and deliver a great mix, the motor can be deactivated too and the mixing experience is much more like on digital jog wheel players. I am not a scratching DJ, so I cannot really compare it to an actual turntable, it may be a matter of personal preference and skill … to me the motorized platters feel a bit more organic or natural

Thanks Parysatis. That’s what I was thinking!

[Dajman73]

@SlayForMoney

I’m gonna play the devils advocate and say that even Prime 4 is overkill for both you and your boy.

There is a reason beginner level equipment exists and by the time you learn all of the Prime 4 features it will be obsolete.

Thanks Slay. . Fair point, but I like shiny new things and we are enjoying ourselves. If sc7000s or 6000+ come out, I will be tempted…………… and why not eh??

@Wyley1

Looking at the new Rane device my advice to you is to wait for the new 6000m models to come out because it seems that they will receive the same type motorized jog that the new Rane has.

I would wait for new release for sure…… thanks

@PKtheDJ

LOL herein lies the problem with asking a bunch of DJs whether or not to get this or that kit!

Very true PK!!

@Gaian

Static jogs have their share of problems too

@Gaian

Each version has its advantages and disadvantages.

Thanks Gaian, very true!

[Dajman73]

Thanks Mixlive. Appreciate your thoughts

[STU-C]

@Dajman73

Thanks Stu. Interesting suggestion, but not sure I want to start collecting vinyl!!

Buy some and see, but just don’t point the finger at me when the mrs starts waging war with you for being addicted lol

In seriousness though, you could do a lot worse than a pair of 1210s and DVS, it’s been my go to setup at home for about 16yrs now. Just remember you can easily turn a 1210 into a fully featured digital media player (with accompanying controller for cue pads and loops etc) but you can’t play vinyl on a CDJ type device.

[player5]

I would get the M because if you are use to turntables you with regret not getting them. I got the 5000 then got the 6000M with no regrets. A old turntable head for sure and yes I have 1200 as well.

[SlayForMoney]

@Dajman73

Thanks Slay. . Fair point, but I like shiny new things and we are enjoying ourselves. If sc7000s or 6000+ come out, I will be tempted…………… and why not eh??

I know, we all do. Just be aware the shiny new things have got way to many shiny new knobs and features that will constantly take away your focus from learning the basics. It takes time and practice to learn stuff

[djliquidice]

@mufasa

I have a set of 6000m from release date and they are the truth.

Preach, brother!!

[Skaratak]

@STU-C

In seriousness though, you could do a lot worse than a pair of 1210s and DVS, it’s been my go to setup at home for about 16yrs now. Just remember you can easily turn a 1210 into a fully featured digital media player (with accompanying controller for cue pads and loops etc) but you can’t play vinyl on a CDJ type device.

That was one of the reasons for me to get a Prime 4. I always wanted to get ‘proper’ turntables myself. The required space was one of the main issues why I kept it simple and went on a long journey from CDJs (starting with the cute 200’s) to controllers (MC6000, DDJ-SX, DJ808,…) and finally AiO (Mixstream, Live4, Prime4). Now I have plenty of space to add one or two turntables and build a small collection of good ol’ Vinyl. Still consider getting a Xone23 or Warm2 in the future, but the P4 as jack-of-all-trades can do the job as well.

Still, I would absolutely love to see the Prime 4 utilizing noisemap control vinyls to directly control decks 3 & 4 without the need of Serato or any extra laptop, aka integrated Engine DVS. Add midi mapping (–> Reloop RP8000) and hallelujah!

Another cool, additional option (and strong message for the InMusic cross-brand-compatibility) would be direct plug & play with the Rane Twelve in HID/Midi mode. This would also eliminate the need for a LC6000M - we already have one, basically. Or a standalone Rane Performer (aka P4M).

[MrWilks]

@Skaratak

Still consider getting a Xone23 or Warm2

I’m considering a Warm2 as well maybe I’ll take the plunge at some point.

@Skaratak

noisemap control vinyls to directly control decks 3 & 4

This would be great but now MWM have opened up Phase for use with other software it would be a good option.

@Skaratak

direct plug & play with the Rane Twelve in HID/Midi mode

Did I see last year that it was on the cards? I’m sure I’d seen it on one of those live streams with Jason? Maybe I was dreaming but I’m sure it was somewhere. Maybe the iDJ live stream.