Nobody has an issue with complaints, we all make them. My own device had to be repaired TWICE before it worked properly again. Every single one of my 10 votes or feature requests hasn’t been implemented.
What is an issue is when the ONLY thing being offered to the forum is negativity, complaints and just general trolling (like the OP of this threads comment history would suggest)
Look at how many people create an account and don’t even say ‘Hello I’m XXX and I DJ in YYY’…. They just dive straight in with ‘Yeah well if Denon want to compete they should be doing this and I can’t believe they haven’t added this now’ as their opening gambit.
Would you walk into a room and start a conversation in that manner? If the answer is no then it should be no different joining a forum or other online community.
Not relevant to one person does not mean a free feature is not relevant.
There are so many different DJ work-genres (wedding, festival, party, bar, club, real geographical radio, home-streamer, bedroom, hobby etc) out there, and each DJ in any given work-genre outs their own spin on the way they want to be perceived to lift themselves above other DJs within their same work-genre.
Inmusic know that, appreciate that and deliver a range of products and feature-sets to encompass as many markets as possible.
There was some (in my opinion) ridiculous talk on one of the social media pages recently which went along the lines that if three new features are introduced free on firmware, then there should be several different firmware files made available for users to download. Download “A” would contain new features 1,2 and 3 …. Download “B” would contain only features 1 and 3… download “C” would only contain features 1 and 2, download “D” would have featured 2 and 3 only. Each user then Cherry-picks which download they want
Ok that’s plausible that month… although 4 different firmwares is gonna be a pain in the neck to beta test… but what about the next month, when feature 5,6 and 7 come out …. You’d need a download option for adding 5 and 7 for those who last month picked only 2 & 3 etc - and suddenly you’re into a complicated matrix of hundreds of different firmwares - and that’s PER prime model - completely unmanageable and is as unrealistic as the phrases “my idea should be really easy to add”
With several hundred requests (and let’s not forget that… they are only requests) for new firmware features, even if InMusic did impliment ALL of them free of charge… they’re not all going to appear on one almighty massive firmware update. Also by the time 10 new features are launched 20 new requests (again… “requests” will have been added (probs ly with the words “should be really easy to impliment” lol) so there’s never going to be a point where ever my request got added. That will cause some people to kick out then lash out with “denon never listen to users” and other such nonsense - such a shame that so many want to ride the gift horse, yet so many look it straight in the mouth
I paid full price for a Denon standalone knowing that there are updates, looking at the features and the implementation is a not too cheeky. Have Denon some charity manifesto or something, that I missed?
3.1 OS(irrc) was the update that I regarded as important, from what I knew then, then the Serratothing made me jump on the train. I like most things about my gear but some things are quite bad, regarding being a prime model. And it does’nt matter that other brands have issues too, it doesn’t take away Denon’s shortcomings.
I didn’t plan to be here from the beginning it was the problems and the research that brought me here. I’m glad that the forum exists and that one can share good or bad things, still the latter seems not always welcome to point at.
Also, when starting to look at a controller a year ago I dismissed the Prime GO immediately since the vertical waveforms, which was in most selling pictures. Then after a long research, I was planning for a DDJ8(irrc), decided to have a standalone unit, then checked the Prime GO again and found videos showing horizontal views my interest changed. Very unfortunate for Denon with these odd vertical views, I guess more customers than I hesitated and dismissed the product.
To new customers: There are horizontal views, hooray(stuttering though)!
There’s absolutely nothing in the T&C’s you agree to when you buy a Prime unit that states there will be anything added to the device in future updates, InMusic are not obliged to change anything on these devices, you buy the product in its current state and have no reason to expect anything else from them throughout its life.
So yes, any new features added for free are essentially a gift, because there is no written contract that states they need to be added.
It’s nice for the buyer to have new features added, and flaws corrected. And because InMusic knows this they do this giving them an advantage over other players, right? Essentially a business model. Not essentially a gift.
Complaining customers shouldn’t be shamed for not being grateful when pointing out new existing problems or not yet corrected ones.
@STU-C May I ask, are you paid to talk like you talk?
I’m not paid at all, and if you look through my comment history (unlike your own, mine is visible) you’ll see that I’ve done plenty of complaining and plenty of feature requesting. In fact none of the 10 things I’ve voted on have been implemented, you can see this on my profile. None of my feature requests have either.
The issue here is this culture of the eternally disappointed, where praise is rarely given and when it is it’s often just some backhanded compliment always followed by a ‘but’…. I get it, it’s the internet and this kind of attitude is firmly embedded in every single corner, but for those of us who see things with a generally positive and grateful outlook, it’s beyond tiresome having to read it constantly.
To conclude, if your sole purpose of joining this forum is to complain behind a veil of anonymity, you’re not here to be part of a community, you’re here to complain, or worse, be a troll.
I’m a consumer, that likes high quality gear, and I wanted to begin with DJ:ing at home, bought a prime model…
No trolling. I like to learn, I like to understand, I like to see problems being solved. And I like to complain(when needed), both about flawed gear and about biased people that dismiss people complaining about flawed gear, or diminish the importance of the flaws.
If I should have known beforehand about the stuttering waveforms in the prime series I probably would have looked elsewhere, it’s not prime, it’s not even consumer grade, in my opinion. It came like a surprise. I couldn’t try it before buying, that’s not anyone else’s responsibility. But I feel a bit cheated, and the waveforms disturbs me when mixing.
And I’m somewhat angry about the battery implementation, Li-Ion batteries should not be fully charged(only occasionally when needed), they should be cycled/recharged to about 60 percent, max 80 percent, otherwise the lifespan is being reduced. A self-destroying arrangement that you can’t turn off, that’s not my fault. This must have been known to engineers at 2020. It doesn’t affect my mixing though since I mix at home, but I paid for a prime model.
Can you post a video of these ‘stuttering waveforms’ so we can understand the gravity of the issue you’re seeing, such an issue that would lead you to say the following:
As someone who only uses the Prime gear in a professional environment and not at home, I strongly disagree with your assertion here. id like to see these stuttering waveforms though, so please upload a video to your favourite platform so we can see this issue that would force consumers to look elsewhere.
Just to add, ive just googled the ‘elsewhere’ followed by stuttering waveforms, and sure enough there it is, their £2500 media player being reported as having them, just like Rekordbox, Serato, Traktor… you’d soon run out of places to look at this rate.
Believe me I don’t have any platform at all, not making any video at this moment, there was a video here on the forum(iirc) though that shows the visual stutter.
Here’s my thread about the waveforms trouble:
“And, back to 3.1.0: two stutters out on the first 32bars, and one more out of the following 32bars, without touching anything, “Boxed” track. Thirteen stutters out of the whole track, Deck 2 this time. Fourteen stutters out of the whole demo track Ansia, Deck 1.”
You said you would look elsewhere if you had known about it, but the ‘elsewhere’ you refer to all seem to have similar stutters.
With regards to your account of 13 stutters in a track, how often do you spend looking at this waveform? What’s the likelihood of you seeing it every single time? Is it changing the sound or impacting the mix in any way shape or form? Is it stopping you from DJing?
Or do we assume you don’t stand and stare at the screen for the full duration of your set, therefore the likelihood of you seeing it happen is drastically reduced to 2/3 time per track at the most, and it doesn’t impact anything with regards to how you perform.
If you do stare at the screen for the full duration of the set, I can only offer advice here, and that advice is don’t.
The above information might help you understand why the development team here don’t see it as a priority, due to the fact it’s not impacting sound, is relatively intermittent and there are no adverse impacts from it happening.
I used the term “gift horse” in the vernacular of “Never look / looking a gift horse in the mouth”
That said, we all buy our €2000 Primes for €2000 and that’s excellent value for money right there, right then. The bang for your buck is incredible right from day #1. Anything else, feature wise which gets added later is simply just amazing and an absolute bonus.
They’re not little features or “just” bug fixes/patches which have been given to Prime users either, samplers, extra effects, lighting control, WiFi streaming, extra microphone controls and functionality etc have potentially saved users hundreds if not thousands of €€€€ post purchase.
Inmusic have posted more than once on the forums that no/one should buy the Primes if they think there’s a feature that they can’t live without, is missing …. In the hope that by them moaning, praying, guilt-tripping, throwing toys out of strollers on social media, whinging, whining or going “Gorilla manure” will immediately “force” (lol) InMusic into added the (cough) missing feature automatically after purchase.
So for my simple brain Reese, essentially it’s rendering the waveform live rather than storing it as a full file in the DB? I guess that makes sense, especially for huge libraries.
Yes that was/is my understanding. Database grew too much with all the waveforms stored in it. 4GB was easily hit with larger collections and on a FAT32 drive that’s a no go as well.
Yeah I can imagine that would soon bloat, there is no real reason with modern processors why it can’t be rendered live, this slight flicker being a small caveat.
I use mine for about 4.5hrs at a time at gigs and I can safely say the way the waveform moves across the screen has absolutely no bearing on my ability to DJ or line tracks up, or create loops etc.
As @Reese said. That database grew very large and searching and loading was being impacted. With 2.0 the waveforms were stripped from the database and were drawn live. The database size shrunk a lot.
I’m hoping for a fix at some point but it doesn’t impact how I play.
Oh, I don’t doubt that some people experience stuttering waveforms. I was just saying that I have not experienced it with mine. Not once. Always flowing smoothly since day one.