I’m a consumer, that likes high quality gear, and I wanted to begin with DJ:ing at home, bought a prime model…
No trolling. I like to learn, I like to understand, I like to see problems being solved. And I like to complain(when needed), both about flawed gear and about biased people that dismiss people complaining about flawed gear, or diminish the importance of the flaws.
If I should have known beforehand about the stuttering waveforms in the prime series I probably would have looked elsewhere, it’s not prime, it’s not even consumer grade, in my opinion. It came like a surprise. I couldn’t try it before buying, that’s not anyone else’s responsibility. But I feel a bit cheated, and the waveforms disturbs me when mixing.
And I’m somewhat angry about the battery implementation, Li-Ion batteries should not be fully charged(only occasionally when needed), they should be cycled/recharged to about 60 percent, max 80 percent, otherwise the lifespan is being reduced. A self-destroying arrangement that you can’t turn off, that’s not my fault. This must have been known to engineers at 2020. It doesn’t affect my mixing though since I mix at home, but I paid for a prime model.
Can you post a video of these ‘stuttering waveforms’ so we can understand the gravity of the issue you’re seeing, such an issue that would lead you to say the following:
As someone who only uses the Prime gear in a professional environment and not at home, I strongly disagree with your assertion here. id like to see these stuttering waveforms though, so please upload a video to your favourite platform so we can see this issue that would force consumers to look elsewhere.
Just to add, ive just googled the ‘elsewhere’ followed by stuttering waveforms, and sure enough there it is, their £2500 media player being reported as having them, just like Rekordbox, Serato, Traktor… you’d soon run out of places to look at this rate.
Believe me I don’t have any platform at all, not making any video at this moment, there was a video here on the forum(iirc) though that shows the visual stutter.
Here’s my thread about the waveforms trouble:
“And, back to 3.1.0: two stutters out on the first 32bars, and one more out of the following 32bars, without touching anything, “Boxed” track. Thirteen stutters out of the whole track, Deck 2 this time. Fourteen stutters out of the whole demo track Ansia, Deck 1.”
You said you would look elsewhere if you had known about it, but the ‘elsewhere’ you refer to all seem to have similar stutters.
With regards to your account of 13 stutters in a track, how often do you spend looking at this waveform? What’s the likelihood of you seeing it every single time? Is it changing the sound or impacting the mix in any way shape or form? Is it stopping you from DJing?
Or do we assume you don’t stand and stare at the screen for the full duration of your set, therefore the likelihood of you seeing it happen is drastically reduced to 2/3 time per track at the most, and it doesn’t impact anything with regards to how you perform.
If you do stare at the screen for the full duration of the set, I can only offer advice here, and that advice is don’t.
The above information might help you understand why the development team here don’t see it as a priority, due to the fact it’s not impacting sound, is relatively intermittent and there are no adverse impacts from it happening.
I used the term “gift horse” in the vernacular of “Never look / looking a gift horse in the mouth”
That said, we all buy our €2000 Primes for €2000 and that’s excellent value for money right there, right then. The bang for your buck is incredible right from day #1. Anything else, feature wise which gets added later is simply just amazing and an absolute bonus.
They’re not little features or “just” bug fixes/patches which have been given to Prime users either, samplers, extra effects, lighting control, WiFi streaming, extra microphone controls and functionality etc have potentially saved users hundreds if not thousands of €€€€ post purchase.
Inmusic have posted more than once on the forums that no/one should buy the Primes if they think there’s a feature that they can’t live without, is missing …. In the hope that by them moaning, praying, guilt-tripping, throwing toys out of strollers on social media, whinging, whining or going “Gorilla manure” will immediately “force” (lol) InMusic into added the (cough) missing feature automatically after purchase.
So for my simple brain Reese, essentially it’s rendering the waveform live rather than storing it as a full file in the DB? I guess that makes sense, especially for huge libraries.
Yes that was/is my understanding. Database grew too much with all the waveforms stored in it. 4GB was easily hit with larger collections and on a FAT32 drive that’s a no go as well.
Yeah I can imagine that would soon bloat, there is no real reason with modern processors why it can’t be rendered live, this slight flicker being a small caveat.
I use mine for about 4.5hrs at a time at gigs and I can safely say the way the waveform moves across the screen has absolutely no bearing on my ability to DJ or line tracks up, or create loops etc.
As @Reese said. That database grew very large and searching and loading was being impacted. With 2.0 the waveforms were stripped from the database and were drawn live. The database size shrunk a lot.
I’m hoping for a fix at some point but it doesn’t impact how I play.
Oh, I don’t doubt that some people experience stuttering waveforms. I was just saying that I have not experienced it with mine. Not once. Always flowing smoothly since day one.
The CDJ-3000 only features one layer, got released just two years ago and costs over 2 grands, so I’d damn hope it doesn’t stutter, lol.
All other CDJs and XDJs (minus the RX3 and Opus Quad) have crappy waveform rendering on their sluggish, resistive 20fps touchscreens. I think this is what Reese was talking about, and rightfully so - quite embarrassing it took them that long.
SC5000, released in 2017, already managed a stable 50fps rendering.
My Live 4 renders two waveforms perfectly fine. Very smooth. I don’t mix four decks, so I can’t elaborate on that. I didn’t experience stuttering per se, more like (rare!) freezes of 1-2sec when the whole unit runs into its buffer limit - but I’ve to provoke that, and it was worse than it is now.
Honestly, until I saw it on these forums I never even noticed anything on mine, then after I went looking I noticed every 30 seconds or so a slight flicker… but I had to go looking, and it’s literally irrelevant imo. If people are focused on that, they need to get their heads in the music more, I don’t need to lecture you on it but the whole idea of DJing is to get yourself lost in the music, not a computer screen, there’s games consoles for that
Thank you to those who answered me! And reading again other comments, really inMusic has no obligation to update the equipment with new features, but rather to fix what has been giving problem and does not work as it should! I think the maximum! This is what propagated and groups on Telegram, whatsapp and Facebook, which Denon today has the differential of providing its users with updates that not only correct but also add resources to the equipment, even after years!
And look, sc5000 is there as proof of that! Powerful hardware, has a lot to show within its limitations! Imagine how happy a sc5000 hj owner is, 6 a os later?
But there’s a catch, are we happy? I am yes, I am m intusiasta of technologies, I became intusiasta of Denon! I’m waiting for new updates with an immense anxiety to see what new will have my equipment after updating it! But at the same time, I suffer from silly things like the delay in reading folders via link! That comes update and remains the same! Create playlist directly from the “PREPARE” option? This is a function that will change everything and I can’t wait for it to come out! Ok, use 2 ssds of 1tb In each of the players! Link is only in the last case!
But that’s it! Problems have! But I’m still 1000x my sc6000 than any Pioneer!
The delay thing is super annoying, but many people have reported it and it’s definitely being looked at by InMusic so if they can solve it they will im sure.
This indeed. A steady stutter may appear smooth, but it’s not.
Phil has an old CDJ-3000 vid which is 25fps, but the screen stutters. I would need to see a 3000 IRL to confirm. CDJ-2000’s and XDJ’s are all non-smooth.
