Other issues which might be related to 5.0.x

Engine DJ Hardware Standalone Controllers
21

Could you perform a database cleanup using the latest version of Engine Desktop and then export the data to a different, high-speed storage medium for testing purposes?

Since you mentioned that this occurs on various SC players, I think we can rule out a hardware issue with the players themselves.

It is almost certainly an issue related to your database and/or your storage medium. Keep in mind that some cheap storage media can have poor read speeds; furthermore, the way tracks are read differs between CDJs and SC players, and the database structure is different as well.

Which USB storage model are you using?

I have two SC6000M units here myselfā€”which share essentially the same internal hardware as the SC5000 (same CPU, RAM, etc.)ā€”and I havenā€™t experienced any issues with either my Netac ZX20L external SSD or my Samsung Bar Plus USB drive, which reaches read speeds of 400 MB/s.

So, before blaming the players themselvesā€”especially given that the problem occurs on six different unitsā€”you should consider whether the issue might stem from your source (storage medium, file type, format, bitrate, database, oversized cover art on certain tracks, etc.).

22

This happened to me twice on 4.3.4

It happened when playing a specific track. Was only able to play properly the track after reencoding from flac to aiff.

Could either be a problem with corrupted metadata or database. I didnā€™t investigate much

23

Perhaps 5.0.4 resolved audio drops for you and your hardware, but for me and my SC5000s, it has made it worse.

24

As stated before by others. Itā€™s most likely has to do with your specific EngineDJ database, especially due to the behavior showcased in your video.

I believe you will be better off with a focused thread to help you, instead of mixing messages (we all prefer mixing music i guess :wink: )

Anyhow, please let us know your test results based on the questions asked and lets take it from there..

25

Hey @tonelab77 ,

e.g. @Gaian gave you some suggestions, did anything of this work out?

Have you reached out for help at the official inMusic support ?

That video is not really on topic of the thread. But in regarding the stutter/lags, stress your device similar to the earlier mentioned tests. If you take a record of it, chances to get your problems fixed increases.

:rofl: The last 2 month been bumpy but isnā€™t it ironic Beatport funktioniert nicht auf meinem CDJ-3000X - YouTube ā€¦ hope u ainā€™t facing your next problem.

26

Here are a few questions that might help narrow down the problem:

  • Which audio format is most frequently affected (FLAC, MP3, AAC, etc.)?
  • Does the issue always occur with the same tracks, or is it completely random?
  • Does it typically happen only after the system has been running for a while, or can it occur immediately after startup?
  • Which player loses the waveform: the one connected directly to the USB/SSD, or the one accessing the library over the network?
  • When the waveform disappears, does the audio stop at the same time, or does the track continue playing silently?

Iā€™m asking because these details may help narrow down whether the issue is related to media access, player communication, or something else entirely. At the moment it seems to be a fairly uncommon issue, so every bit of additional information could be useful.

I know you already touched on some of thisā€”at least in broad termsā€”earlier on. But Iā€™d like to clarify things just to avoid any misunderstandings.

27

Just a guess here as you also failed to state what sorce you are using?

USB, SSD, or streaming.

For a hard-wired source, it is indeed a little strange and could be OS problem.

If you are using the streaming services, then it is another thing altogetherā€¦

28

I donā€™t use beatport to stream music on my CDJ-3000Xs. I load music on my USBs and play from there, so that is a non-issue.

29

The issue is that I leave my Denon players at my Friday gig. My plan was to take a flash drive with 5.0.1 or 5.0.3 to downgrade them this Friday. I didnā€™t know about a library database cleanup until it was mentioned here. I guess I can test if the cleanup worked on my GFā€™s SC5000s. Iā€™ll do that and report back. Thanks for the tip!

P.S. I use a Samsung 2TB T7 USB SSD and a SSK 2TB SSD (Amazon.com)

30
    1. MP3 but also happens with AIFF. I rarely play FLAC.
    1. Completely random
    1. I havenā€™t noticed but if memory serves me right, it seems like it was happening later in evening, and not at the beginning. Are you hinting at possible overheating?
    1. Both players lose the waveform.
    1. Audio drops when the waveform stops. You can see the waveform end coming if youā€™re watching, and once it hits the playhead, the audio stops.

Thank you for showing interest!

31

I have been using my SSD drive connected by USB

32

I suggest using a powered USB 3.0 hub to connect your SSD to Denon gear. The USB ports are only 500mA, a SSD wants to see 1A. Only the Rane System 1 has sufficient USB bus power.

33

I think both T5 and T7 use similar power. I donā€™t recall issues with the T5, as for years Iā€™ve been using internal SSDā€™s and an occasional Samsung Extreme stick.

34

Hello,

Thanks for taking the time to answer these questions.

I wasnā€™t specifically thinking about overheating. I asked because the timing of the issue can sometimes help narrow down the cause.

From what Iā€™ve observed with the Prime 2, the symptoms of an actual cooling or fan control failure are usually quite different. The CPU tends to hang, the entire unit freezes, and in most cases a restart or a long press of the power button is required to get the device running again. Thatā€™s why I donā€™t consider overheating the most likely explanation here.

What I find most interesting about your answers is that both players are affected and the problem occurs completely at random. To me, that makes a defect in a single player much less likely.

Iā€™d also be interested to know more about your media setup.

Does this only happen when playing from an external USB drive? Has it ever happened when playing from an internal SSD?

Someone mentioned USB hubs earlier. Even though I donā€™t know if thereā€™s a connection, I would definitely try to rule out any components between the drive and the player as a potential source of the problem.

I also consider a power supply issue relatively unlikely. The internal power supplies are generally generously rated. While brief voltage dips are possible, I would expect to see other symptoms in that case.

Another possibilityā€”although probably a long shotā€”is electrostatic discharge (ESD). Have you ever noticed getting static shocks when touching your equipment? It sounds a bit far-fetched, but clothing and footwear can make a surprising difference, and ESD can occasionally interfere with electronic equipment. If this were the cause, though, I wouldnā€™t expect it to happen at every venue.

The reason this even crossed my mind is a real-world example. I occasionally work at a club, and one of the DJs builds up so much static electricity because of his shoes that he actually has to wear an ESD wrist strap while performing. Otherwise, he has managed to disrupt parts of the lighting and audio system just by touching the equipment. Touching him yourself feels like grabbing an electric fence! So while it sounds unlikely, static electricity can sometimes produce some very unexpected behaviour.

Iā€™m simply trying to narrow down the potential causes step by step.

35

The T5 draws 500mA under heavy data transfer.

36

I had to move a synthetic rug that was next to my home dj booth due to it and had various experiences in clubs: fog machines acting like mini EMPs next to audio equipment and/or on the same power outlet, strobe lights doing same/similar.

Troubleshooting indeed can be a biatchā€¦

37

Yeah in USB2 mode. I thought it would go up to 900mA in USB3 mode, but thatā€™s the same for the T7.

Anyway not unusual high.

38

After thinking about this for a while and reviewing everything that has been shared so far, Iā€™m starting to think that DJDragonā€™s suggestion of using a powered USB hub deserves much more attention.

This is, of course, only a hypothesis, but hereā€™s my reasoning:

From what Iā€™ve seen on the Prime 2, the internal power supply only provides a single 12 V rail. All other voltages (5 V, 3.3 V, CPU core voltages, etc.) are generated on the mainboard by DC/DC converters. I canā€™t say for certain that the SC5000 uses the same design, but I would expect a very similar power architecture.

The Samsung T7 is known to have relatively high peak current demands compared to a typical USB flash drive. It doesnā€™t draw that current continuously, but transient peaks are completely normal for SSDs.

USB ports are designed with defined current limits. Depending on the USB standard, thatā€™s typically 500 mA or 900 mA. An external SSD can occasionally approach or even exceed those values during peak demand, even if its average power consumption is much lower.

If Engine OS has changed the internal workload over timeā€”even through optimisations rather than bugsā€”the timing of CPU, storage and other power demands may also have shifted slightly. A system that was already operating close to its limits with an external SSD could then become unstable only occasionally, which would also explain why the problem appears to be random.

Because of that, I now think using a powered USB hub is probably one of the most worthwhile tests. It would largely remove the SSDā€™s power consumption from the playerā€™s USB supply. If the issue disappears with a powered hub, that would be a very strong indication that the problem is related to USB power delivery or USB stability rather than the player itself.

Iā€™m not saying this is definitely the cause, but based on everything weā€™ve learned so far, I think itā€™s currently one of the most plausible theories and certainly worth testing.

39

Doesnā€™t happen when Iā€™m streaming from Tidal. Iā€™m using SSD connected through USB.

40

Yea. I was having random external drive disconnects on my SC5000 and added a powered Hub that resolved it. Metered and a scoped the USB pins during data access and I can see power draw fluctuate.