SC6000 Sound Quality

For the different gain between traktor and the SC6000 it’s because in the last firmware update Denon applied a -6db pads for better dynamic range and loudness control

[quote=“MrMaiTai, post:20, topic:29439”] made the same leap as yourself to Denon from Traktor coupled with a Xone 96. Now you’ve mentioned this I’ll give them a side by side comparison when I can as I’m slightly concerned. I haven’t used Traktor for a few month and only got the 6000’s a few week ago, I’ve not noticed anything major - but i’m no audiophile! I run my gains at 12 o’clock with the 6000’s which has been fine. I’ll keep you posted

Maybe I will not worry you, I knew straight away after playing my first track on the Denon, I was concerned that something sounded off, so I booted up my computer & loaded a DVS vinyl track, played the same track side by side & sure enough my doubts were justified.

I actually just spent a couple of hours mixing on the SC6000 & have to say the more time I spent on it, the more I feel in Love with the unit itself, the pitch control is one of the best I have ever used, I love the way everything is integrated, the artwork on the decks is really cool, the jog wheel is a bit ordinary, but I could get use to it, overall they are pretty awesome & I am just scratching the surface, but the sound, that is a deal breaker, what a let down, if you aren’t use to anything better it may be fine for most people, but I noticed it more & more as I played on it, especially when two tracks are in the mix, I just gets really muddy…

[quote=“tellor01, post:22, topic:29439, full:true”] For the different gain between traktor and the SC6000 it’s because in the last firmware update Denon applied a -6db pads for better dynamic range and loudness control

I am no expert on this side of things, but that sounds like a shortcut to me & they are ignoring the fundamental problem with there sound processing, they shouldn’t need to do much at all, the player should be staying out of the way as much as possible & letting the mixer do the work, I would love a sound engineer or someone with knowledge on this subject to clarify this? I am just someone who has been exposed to some nice audio equipment through my job & have learnt to listen & trust my ears, beyond that my knowledge of audio is pretty basic…

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All the testing has already been done btw and some testing in this thread too. The conclusion is that the sound should and have to be improved.

Usb audio, from all the mixers that I’ve owned, output higher than the line ins. Just the way it has always been. It would be a far stretch to call it an issue since the purpose of a mixer is to level your audio. Traktor has autogain right?

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it starts around 12khz. that’s also why a 128kbps mp3 still has better highs despite the 16khz lowpass. a simple comparison everyone can do.

if keylock is on the outputs don’t matter because keylock is the culprit. it kills even more highs.

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Keylock is the culprit and 0 pitch should be as close to bit transparent as possible.

However, there is another test one can perform by using two different sets of headphones or speakers.

In my case I have one set of speakers that plays from 26khz-50hz and another that plays 18khz-55hz.

I hear a difference in the first set but the second set I can barely tell the difference in the sources.

Mp3s take a bit of the shockwave away from the sound btw.

Very unusual speakers then.

Yes, there were many discussion about the sound, and also many tests / frequency response diagrams posted and all this. Some conclusions are:

Even when pitch is 0, “master tempo” / key stretch is off and you are using uncompressed 44.1KHz (say WAV or AIFF) audio files - the SC5000/SC6000 is doing sample rate conversion. All audio is output with a fixed sample rate of 96KHz. So it has to touch the audio data, and apparently has to do some anti-aliasing or filtering stuff to correct any artefacts of the SRC.

Players like e.g. the CDJ 2000NXS2 are keeping the sample rate of the input material, so are able to output unmodified 1:1 digital audio. This apparently has also changed with the CDJ3000, who is also doing SRC - it would be very interesting to see the differences between this player and the Denons.

Anyone here would get a CDJ3000 for testing and doing some comparison? :slight_smile:

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Would it be unusual if the 26khz-50hz were made to be mounted outdoors and play in light snow or rain and still sound beautiful?

Correct, this is not the issue (and there is a issue let’s be honest). Different sources have different output levels (even between brands of multimedia players) and that is the whole reason for gain knobs on dj mixers.

But, I always like to read such posts because it does tell you the level of knowledge a person posseses.

Is it the same issue everybody is discussing here? If not then share.

My only wish is to see flagship sound quality and full spectrum beat gridding on deck. That way I know that anybody can play on the decks.

I just switched from Traktor to the SC6000, the mixer is a DB4 and I use the digital in (and for Traktor I used the internal sound card in the mixer). I honestly don’t notice any difference. However, have not yet tried to connect the SC6000 via the analog inputs. Headphones are the Beyerdynamic DT770 pro.

However, I must admit that 20 years ago I once stood in a hot techno night for hours next to the PA and since then my hearing is no longer really HIFI suitable …

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In the test I did, there wasn’t rolloff until 16kHz. I did my test without keylock engaged. I referenced keylock in case op has keylock engaged constantly like a lot of deejays do now.

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Personally, I don’t notice the rolloff, but it’s for the same reason I pay someone else to master my music. Years of producing and deejaying have wrecked hell on my hearing.

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have a look at the threads i linked above. all of that has been proven over and over again by different people. and in doubt you can still do the 128kbps mp3 test.

I had the same problems when playing out via analog ports. They sound much sharper to me via digital output on my Xone DB2. I’d have returned mine if I didn’t have a digital mixer.

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SlayForMoney

6h

[quote=“Wyley1, post:24, topic:29439”] Usb audio, from all the mixers that I’ve owned, output higher than the line ins. Just the way it has always been. It would be a far stretch to call it an issue since the purpose of a mixer is to level your audio

Correct, this is not the issue (and there is a issue let’s be honest). Different sources have different output levels (even between brands of multimedia players) and that is the whole reason for gain knobs on dj mixers.

But, I always like to read such posts because it does tell you the level of knowledge a person posseses

I understand this & didn’t ever proclaim to have any high level of knowledge, just trusting what I hear. I understand that difference sources output levels though, if plug a turntable into an amplifier it’s always going to be a lower output for example, but what I am referring to is not just volume output, when I have to to turn the gain up so much it is almost red lining & still doesn’t retain any of the sound characteristics & details of Xone 96 internal sound, then to me something is seriously wrong…

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I had mine connected to a 92 for a bit and while I did notice a slight drop in perceivable loudness, the gain didn’t need to bring the signal into the reds to correct. Have you tested another line level source and is this behavior consistent after the mixer is on for an hour +?

I don’t really have don’t any other line source I can test, only vinyl through the phono inputs, which is obviously lower output & normal for phono input, but I didn’t need to take the gain past 12 O’clock with vinyl.

I just realised I have a Native Instruments Komplete Audio 6 interface in my cupboard somewhere that has a digital input, it’s not the greatest sounding thing, but may give me some idea of comparing the digital & analog signals coming from the SC6000, would I need to buy a digital cable or can I get away with using the provided analog cables that come with the unit? Very surprising that Denon don’t give you a digital cable with the SC6000…

exactly, so called digital cables are the same just with better specs. for more see Recommendation digital cable

Thank you Joxani

Can I ask a stupid question?

I have never connected anything via digital output before, but I have connected the digital output on the SC6000 into the digital input SPDIF on my Komplete Audio 6 interface, then I am taking two RCA outputs from the audio interface into the line in, on the XONE 96 mixer & there is no signal at all, am I doing something wrong?